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Post by Goobsausage on Apr 24, 2016 1:47:27 GMT -6
Hey, remember how Update 37 asked for vines of people doing stuff with umbrellas? Is there a time limit or cutoff date to submit them? Hopefully someone like Dangamer, Fangamer Steve, or Mana can swoop in and give some info if it's not floating out there already.
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Post by Scars Unseen on Apr 24, 2016 10:10:48 GMT -6
The whole vine thing still confuses me. Is that some new Tumblr Instagram sort of thing?
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Post by Goobsausage on Apr 25, 2016 0:52:09 GMT -6
The whole vine thing still confuses me. Is that some new Tumblr Instagram sort of thing? It's a social media platform where people share 6-second videos that loop over and over. It reminds me of YTMND from about 10 years ago, but with people filming themselves instead of using or making gifs and images and adding text.
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Mana
Official Staff
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Post by Mana on Apr 25, 2016 2:24:34 GMT -6
Hey, remember how Update 37 asked for vines of people doing stuff with umbrellas? Is there a time limit or cutoff date to submit them? Hopefully someone like Dangamer , Fangamer Steve , or Mana can swoop in and give some info if it's not floating out there already. I don't think there's a set deadline for it. We're going to send Fangamer the update materials tomorrow so we're going to assume the cutoff time is in a day or two after.
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Cernex
Loyal Familiar
Still learning how things work
Posts: 188
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Still learning how things work
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Post by Cernex on Apr 25, 2016 14:27:56 GMT -6
Everything seems to look pretty awesome if you ask me. Sure she's a little floaty, but it's nothing incredibly troublesome, or that I would probably learn to ignore a few hours into the game. The kick looks neat (wonder just WHAT are you going to be able to do with it, tho')
Nice seeing the grid map too. That explains how the previous Metroidvania castle designs (IN MY HONEST OPINION, except maybe AoS) were so tight.
Shame about the scarf, tho'. Hope we'll be able to see it next update.
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Post by giwagiwa on Apr 26, 2016 11:01:38 GMT -6
With that said there are some things to consider. The most important aspect would be maintaining your position while attacking. In a platform game positioning is crucial, and an attack that moves your character forward immediately becomes a gamble. You dont want to fall off a platform because the character steps forward during an attack. The above is sort of a general rule in 2D platformer design theory, but it certainly can be broken. If you have a sword that deals massive damage but moves the character forward a considerable amount when attacking then that creates a risk vs reward meta game. Things like this, when designed well, add strategic depth and variety to a game. I don't necessarily agree. When you think about it, it's really odd for a person to remain standing still in place while attacking. Watch a kendo/fencing match and you'll see both players lunging forward or stretching their arms out whenever they attack to get some added range. Footwork is really important. It's funny you mention this, because it's a mechanic in Dark Souls/Bloodborne that practically every weapon attack moves your character forward even if just a bit, so you have to be careful when you're next to a cliff. However, no one complains about this because the controls are so well implemented it's always the player's fault if they accidentally fall.
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purifyweirdshard
Administrator
Administrator
Calling from Heaven
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Post by purifyweirdshard on Apr 27, 2016 10:36:27 GMT -6
Oh man, I need to try to get on this umbrella vine thing. I hope I have something that can record decent video...
Hey Sunscreen, that new avatar is pretty nito.
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Mana
Official Staff
[TI0]
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Post by Mana on Apr 28, 2016 1:53:38 GMT -6
Oh man, I need to try to get on this umbrella vine thing. I hope I have something that can record decent video... Hey Sunscreen, that new avatar is pretty nito. Even if it doesn't get on the update, we'd all love to see it! And did you just call Scars Unseen Sunscreen...? Can't "unsee" it now (someone needs to hit me) But yes, nice avatar.
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Post by Scars Unseen on Apr 28, 2016 4:59:01 GMT -6
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purifyweirdshard
Administrator
Administrator
Calling from Heaven
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Post by purifyweirdshard on Apr 28, 2016 7:23:39 GMT -6
Wow. I'll have to check more of his stuff out later. And yeah, I did say that lol. I give people silly names sometimes. I play with words/puns way too much in my head I think
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Astaroth
Fifty Storms
What a wonderful night to have a curse...
Posts: 1,213
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What a wonderful night to have a curse...
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Post by Astaroth on Apr 28, 2016 20:20:47 GMT -6
With that said there are some things to consider. The most important aspect would be maintaining your position while attacking. In a platform game positioning is crucial, and an attack that moves your character forward immediately becomes a gamble. You dont want to fall off a platform because the character steps forward during an attack. The above is sort of a general rule in 2D platformer design theory, but it certainly can be broken. If you have a sword that deals massive damage but moves the character forward a considerable amount when attacking then that creates a risk vs reward meta game. Things like this, when designed well, add strategic depth and variety to a game. I don't necessarily agree. When you think about it, it's really odd for a person to remain standing still in place while attacking. Watch a kendo/fencing match and you'll see both players lunging forward or stretching their arms out whenever they attack to get some added range. Footwork is really important. It's funny you mention this, because it's a mechanic in Dark Souls/Bloodborne that practically every weapon attack moves your character forward even if just a bit, so you have to be careful when you're next to a cliff. However, no one complains about this because the controls are so well implemented it's always the player's fault if they accidentally fall. well, you can achieve the illusion of forward momentum without actually moving the character forward through the characters motions during the animation, while weapons that actually move you forward like the estoc can certainly be a thing, it should be a special property on a few weapons, especially if this property is active during jumps because it has the potential of allowing sequence breaking (not to say sequence breaking is bad and shouldnt be allowed, just that this needs to be weighted towards being an advanced skill to not make it too easy to perform, and if a lot of weapons have this nudge property then you have to plan for people abusing that nudge on their first playthrough, which has the side effect of making even simple jumps harder for those who dont know about the nudge trick) a bit rambly, but i hope i got my point across there >P
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purifyweirdshard
Administrator
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Calling from Heaven
Posts: 3,789
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Nov 22, 2024 16:16:48 GMT -6
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Post by purifyweirdshard on Apr 29, 2016 12:50:46 GMT -6
The forums are just barely offscreen to the left. lol
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Kaius
Loyal Familiar
[TI2]My heart is blood, my blood is glass, my soul is frozen.
Posts: 235
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Sept 10, 2016 6:55:13 GMT -6
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[TI2]My heart is blood, my blood is glass, my soul is frozen.
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Post by Kaius on Apr 30, 2016 0:54:50 GMT -6
The forums are just barely offscreen to the left. lol We need to see more of this ! It's excellent. I'm sure IGA can find a lot of ideas into fans videos.
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giwagiwa
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Post by giwagiwa on May 1, 2016 7:52:21 GMT -6
well, you can achieve the illusion of forward momentum without actually moving the character forward through the characters motions during the animation, while weapons that actually move you forward like the estoc can certainly be a thing, it should be a special property on a few weapons, especially if this property is active during jumps because it has the potential of allowing sequence breaking (not to say sequence breaking is bad and shouldnt be allowed, just that this needs to be weighted towards being an advanced skill to not make it too easy to perform, and if a lot of weapons have this nudge property then you have to plan for people abusing that nudge on their first playthrough, which has the side effect of making even simple jumps harder for those who dont know about the nudge trick) a bit rambly, but i hope i got my point across there >P It makes sense to move the player on the ground, but not in the air. Unless they're using magic or wings or something. It's OK for aerial attacks to work slightly different than on the ground. Also as far as the whole falling off a platform thing, you can make it so the player stops moving forward at the edge of a platform when the attack would normally have them fall off the ledge. Much like how it works in Super Smash Bros (look at Ike's left/right B dashing attack).
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Jango
New Blood
Posts: 72
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Oct 19, 2018 19:35:22 GMT -6
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jango
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Post by Jango on May 1, 2016 23:09:43 GMT -6
well, you can achieve the illusion of forward momentum without actually moving the character forward through the characters motions during the animation, while weapons that actually move you forward like the estoc can certainly be a thing, it should be a special property on a few weapons, especially if this property is active during jumps because it has the potential of allowing sequence breaking (not to say sequence breaking is bad and shouldnt be allowed, just that this needs to be weighted towards being an advanced skill to not make it too easy to perform, and if a lot of weapons have this nudge property then you have to plan for people abusing that nudge on their first playthrough, which has the side effect of making even simple jumps harder for those who dont know about the nudge trick) a bit rambly, but i hope i got my point across there >P It makes sense to move the player on the ground, but not in the air. Unless they're using magic or wings or something. It's OK for aerial attacks to work slightly different than on the ground. Also as far as the whole falling off a platform thing, you can make it so the player stops moving forward at the edge of a platform when the attack would normally have them fall off the ledge. Much like how it works in Super Smash Bros (look at Ike's left/right B dashing attack). Most 3d games do move the character forward when using melee attacks, but that comes at a price. VERY few 3D games require the positional accuracy of older 2d games so it's not as big of a deal if the attack animations advance the player. And like it was mentioned before, advancing when attacking is generally more realistic. Videogames seldom (if ever) strive for realism in movement. Controlling horizontal movement when in the air is a trope that comes to mind. But yeah, 3d games usually dont have to worry about things like pitfalls and pixel-perfect collision and platforming. Those games have a z axis to play with so that is typically what's emphasized rather than things like precise jumps. But back in the nes days, if Simon Belmont moved forward during attacks you can just imagine how many medusa heads you'd eat. That would likely make the game unplayable for most. It all comes down to design though. If pitfalls and platforming arent very important in Bloodstained then advancing attacks would likely be fine. Hopefully BS will have a mixture of both, with good level design to make advancing attacks something for the player to strategically consider.
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Astaroth
Fifty Storms
What a wonderful night to have a curse...
Posts: 1,213
inherit
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Jan 4, 2022 11:47:39 GMT -6
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Astaroth
What a wonderful night to have a curse...
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Post by Astaroth on May 2, 2016 15:53:05 GMT -6
speaking from past games and things iga has said in the past, platforming will be in, some difficult jumps will be in, falling a distance if you miss a platform will be in, instadeath pitfalls and close to pixel perfect jumps are absolutely out EXCEPT perhaps in classic mode (unknown yet if classic mode will have fixed parabolas) if that helps
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Post by giwagiwa on May 2, 2016 22:25:43 GMT -6
Most 3d games do move the character forward when using melee attacks, but that comes at a price. VERY few 3D games require the positional accuracy of older 2d games so it's not as big of a deal if the attack animations advance the player. And like it was mentioned before, advancing when attacking is generally more realistic. Videogames seldom (if ever) strive for realism in movement. Controlling horizontal movement when in the air is a trope that comes to mind. But yeah, 3d games usually dont have to worry about things like pitfalls and pixel-perfect collision and platforming. Those games have a z axis to play with so that is typically what's emphasized rather than things like precise jumps. But back in the nes days, if Simon Belmont moved forward during attacks you can just imagine how many medusa heads you'd eat. That would likely make the game unplayable for most. It all comes down to design though. If pitfalls and platforming arent very important in Bloodstained then advancing attacks would likely be fine. Hopefully BS will have a mixture of both, with good level design to make advancing attacks something for the player to strategically consider. Like I was attempting to explain, I've seen it work in 2d. You simply don't let the player fall off a platform from a ground attack that moves the player forward, and attacking medusa heads is a matter of getting used to timing like attacking sooner than later. It's all about how well the controls are implemented. Look at Salt and Sanctuary for a 2d example.
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