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Post by XombieMike on May 30, 2019 9:01:10 GMT -6
Well, I really wish 505 would refund you. Your public pressure statement makes sense to me. However, it is affecting everyone here, not just 505, to hear you continue your refund campaign. This wouldn't be an issue of you could just be refunded. Can we compromise? Can you take that to Twitter and not here? I feel the need to keep this place constructive and a place fans want to be. Your words here in the forum are almost just a private statement. Twitter is much more public and influential for your goal, which I wish you luck with.
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Post by XombieMike on May 30, 2019 6:47:10 GMT -6
browren please don't double post. It's in the rules. Just edit your post if you have something to add unless someone has replied since or its been about a full day since your last reply, thanks. I agree with browren about the decisions 505 have made. We can't do anything to change it though. Bloodstained had an amazing Kickstarter due to the way it was handled. 505 wasn't involved and is more focused on getting as much money as possible without regard to the backers that made this possible in the first place. I also think they hold back information from backers that could have been announced long ago, but hold onto it for marketing reasons. I think we may see some of that in today's update. Regardless, if your only purpose on this forum is to repeat yourself to 505 and other backers about your disappointment with the game, could you just stop? I'm not calling for silence. Your points have been heard loud and clear. They just aren't changing anything in a productive way, and is impeding on the experience of satisfied and excited members of this community we have strived to cultivate. All respect intended.
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Post by XombieMike on May 30, 2019 4:47:13 GMT -6
Aztec and Ciel your posts have been moved for staff review due to rules for personal insults and flaming.
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Post by XombieMike on May 21, 2019 21:02:02 GMT -6
Playlist has the other two tracks added. If they need to be reordered just give me simple instructions using the video titles as they appear in the playlist. I can't edit the actual titles of those videos as all I've done is put them in a playlist. The videos are on channels I do not run. Thanks for the two new tracks
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Post by XombieMike on May 16, 2019 17:05:15 GMT -6
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Post by XombieMike on Apr 24, 2019 11:49:22 GMT -6
Hey IGA's Army of the Night, check out Kingdom of the Night! Coincidental reference? I don't think so as this is a DanGen game, and you know how Ben Judd is close with our community.
There is a DM screen you can print off as a certain tier reward... I am certainly curious. No matter what tier you back at, this game has style. Give it a look!
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Post by XombieMike on Feb 19, 2019 20:29:08 GMT -6
So since I backed for 65$ (60$+5$ international shipping) I'm already in the physical backer set, right? So this doesn't apply to me then? Or stating it in a more sarcastic way: Since I payed more then the digital version they can do nothing for me? Apparently not. If I were a publisher that cared about Kickstarter backers and my reputation in the industry though, I'd at least respond to you in private and make sure you were taken care of in any way that you would agree was met with satisfaction.
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Post by XombieMike on Feb 18, 2019 22:55:44 GMT -6
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Post by XombieMike on Feb 18, 2019 22:28:37 GMT -6
Hello everyone. It has come to my attention that progress has been made to assist with backer satisfaction regarding the cancellation of Linux and Mac platforms. My purpose for this post is to alert any affected backer and give a point of instruction for them that can be easily linked to.
On February 15th, 2019, on the Kickstarter comments in a reply to the backer "David", Angel Corlux said the following when addressing the topic,
So, digital Linux and Mac backers, please send and email to orders@fangamer.com. You may reference this post in the email by linking to it.
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Post by XombieMike on Jan 15, 2019 22:10:19 GMT -6
My friend, what the heck? People are making arguments here about suing because the team isn't able to fulfill their Kickstarter platform. You are willing to extend that to every single backer and scrap the game completely? I'm all for giving the community an organized voice and standing up for the minority, but not at the cost of the whole project. Understandable. But yes, I am willing to risk the game as a whole to make things fair for people who earnestly feel cheated. This is just a difference of opinions between you and I. I don't expect many people to agree with me. The longer this project takes the more practices I see that I don't like. I understand that some incidents are unavoidable, but I am very, very tired of giving the benefit of the doubt, along with not holding people accountable. Shifting of development teams and the argument "This was promised by the previous guys, not us." is taking it's toll. No one else finds this discouraging that there is very little accountability? I love this genre, the game, the creator, and this community. I want this to succeed. But at some point you need to ask if it should. Does this game deserve to be released with corners cut? I am all for delays. But that is not the problem that has me concerned. Hindsight is 20/20, but there seems to be a lot of things that could have been predicted. The biggest problem is all of this conjecture. We won't be able to look behind the scenes, and we won't know what can be confirmed or denied. I get that it seems selfish, risking other peoples game for the minority. I just can't stand letting people fight by themselves. I can only speak for myself, but yes, again I am psychotic enough to be willing to pursue equal results for others. You know... you have come to this point without even knowing the stuff behind the scenes I do. Dammit, Cale. Guys, I don't know if I can try and (self proclaim) lead this community any more. It's not just about THIS current mess. It's about everything backers have been through since the Kickstarter closed. Steve from Fangamer got back with me. Here is what they replied, This tells me two things. 1. There are logistical reasons selling backer tiers through Fangamer's site won't work. No one should expect any more explanation than that. It was a good idea, and I like that the community was able to produce such a great suggestion. Thanks, Scars Unseen2. Fangamer's hands sound tied. Cale said, "the argument "This was promised by the previous guys, not us." is taking it's toll. No one else finds this discouraging that there is very little accountability?" Yeah, man. I do find it discouraging. I also find it discouraging that they won't just come out an say they can't discern Linux backers apart from other Steam backers. I also find that although I like Question, I find it disappointing that backers are the ones here trying to reason with rightfully dissatisfied backers more than he or his company on these forums.
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Post by XombieMike on Jan 15, 2019 19:41:17 GMT -6
Your message is unhelpful and your attitude is still poor. Please try and refrain from being so uselessly negative. We all know how you feel right now, dude.
The only thing I can see as hurdles to this is deciding on which backer's tier was resold. If 17 people backed at the $30 level, how are we sure who to mail a check to if only 10 of those get purchased? I doubt it would be a problem, as I think they would all sell. The other hurdle is mailing checks, but that doesn't sound too hard. The logistics of the site will be the tough part.
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Post by XombieMike on Jan 15, 2019 19:00:23 GMT -6
Ok, I've emailed Fangamer Steve with the following: We will see if he responds.
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Post by XombieMike on Jan 15, 2019 18:39:08 GMT -6
I feel I'm too stupid to understand this. Can we voice chat about it?
I'm understanding what you are writing... but I think there are some pretty crazy details here that we might not be thinking of. I'll try and contact Fangamer about it.
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Post by XombieMike on Jan 15, 2019 18:34:15 GMT -6
Oh.... Hmm... This is a new idea.
So, we should just ask Fangamer if it is possible to transfer the pledge (with receipt) to a new person, and the money be taken care of between those two people?
The issue that pops up for me when I think of that is, how does Fangamer know the money was transferred and both parties are happy? What if I say I'm selling my tier to some rando on the internet, but once I get the money just tell them to screw off?
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Post by XombieMike on Jan 15, 2019 18:22:49 GMT -6
We are all posting at the same time. Scars, congrats on the 500 comments. Scars, I also thought of crowd sourcing a refund for these people, and would in fact also put my money in on that effort. However, the big catch that prevents that, is there is no way to validate the claims. If it were just the 17 people here, and they only want refunds for reasonable tiers, I would be more inclined to continue without validation. We don't know what we are looking at though. Plus, what if it ends up working on Wine? That's some Windows emulation or something that some Windows games work on Linux. No idea, but it could happen. Plus, these folks can resale their codes and backer rewards. Also, with crowd funding on our own, transfer fees are a bitch to deal with. As much as I would love to start a crowd funded refund campaign, the chances of it being manageable and realistic are slim at best, and false hope and more disappointment at next to best, and too expensive, taken advantage of, and transfer fee ridden at worst.
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Post by XombieMike on Jan 15, 2019 18:12:09 GMT -6
illasera Half your post was useful information, even though it was snarky. How long do you expect that to fly here? The other half is totally diverting from the topic. If you want to talk about how long the project is taking compared to SotN, do so in a relevant post. That has nothing to do with this current issue in this thread. SotN had a franchise before it to use a lot of assets from. This is done by Artplay which is like... what 6 people now? Outsourcing the game's development bulk to Dico and Mono-bit (and Wayforward now). All that AFTER they broke from IntiCreates. All on a crowd funded campaign that gave loads of stretch goals and backer incorporated content? I could go on and on, but honestly man... you are derailing the topic and you are being a smart ass even when you are on topic. But yeah, like illasera said, Scars. There is no way to even know who is a Linux backer or not. It's not a lack of funds issue, really. If they could be certain of the people to refund, I'm pretty sure they would. It's an issue though when a lot more people than the Linux backers want a refund because the game is taking so long and people have gone on a campaign to sow dissatisfaction. I'm sure that the amount of money 505 Games would have to re-allocate from the game budget would not only harm the final game, but might straight up kill it. The "untold" bit illasera put in is smarmy, but accurate. 505 Games has neither confirmed or denied that they can't tell Linux backers from Windows backers, but the evidence is in the choice that was never given. Fangamer has also declined to let me know if they could validate claims. It's a mess. We have people who deserve a refund, but it's simply impossible. The only real positive outcome I can see to work towards at this point is to show 505 Games they need to put effort into getting those platforms either unofficially or officially supported post launch. Don't expect them to comment on that though, because at this point, making promises to these good folks means nothing and would absolutely be used against them in the future should it prove impossible.
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Post by XombieMike on Jan 15, 2019 15:06:24 GMT -6
gunlord500 As a PS4 backer I would rather lose my chance at the game than have fellow fans go without. Honestly, this is a community. If we don't stand up for the minority then we aren't doing our job as fans. My friend, what the heck? People are making arguments here about suing because the team isn't able to fulfill their Kickstarter platform. You are willing to extend that to every single backer and scrap the game completely? I'm all for giving the community an organized voice and standing up for the minority, but not at the cost of the whole project. Seperate note, if people want to organize for a lawsuit, I can make a thread here and limit it to the soul purpose of you getting together to share info. I can make it a private room for Linux / Mac backers only, trusting that those words request access are indeed backers of that platform (plus myself).
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Post by XombieMike on Jan 15, 2019 10:00:28 GMT -6
I made some edits while you were typing, sorry. Anyways we certainly are on the same side. About "why nothing can or should be done" let me make it clear that I do think something should be done. I've never said anything but that. Now yes though I do believe that something "can't be done" if that something is limited to a refund. I'm open for ideas on other things that might be possible.
absorbnix is saying that, if 505 were operating in good faith, they'd go into more detail than "middleware issues" (as the Kickstarter ToS requires) and wouldn't brush the following options under the rug:
- "We're sorry, but the Linux and Mac ports will be delayed until after launch, as we'll need money from post-launch sales to complete them."
- "We're sorry, but we've decided to cancel the Linux and Mac ports. In order to ensure that the project still completes successfully, we have to delay offering refunds until we can pay them out of post-release sales."
EDIT: Oops. Didn't notice that extra page of discussion. I'm still getting used to this forum software.
Typing on phone so please forgive the quote chain. Just wanted to point out that you and I see the same thing, but understand it differently. "if 505 were operating in good faith, they'd go into more detail than "middleware issues" 505 is certainly are lacking in the regards of giving us a lot of information. To me, the biggest gap of communication is saying if the popular theory is true or not. This doesn't bother me to the Pont of thinking they are an evil corporation though. I understand that if they choose to not answer something in specific like that it's either because they can't due to someone else's involvement or they have a larger picture of things than we do. I don't want to make excuses for them though. This is just what I think is most likely. Of course, that's the gap I'm most curious about. The gap you brought up is why they aren't specific to what problems prevented them from Linux, and how much work had been done before now to ensure native support. Do I have that much correct? If so, the same thing applies to both our gaps. They may have reasons we can't understand because they have a 10,000 foot view of the whole project. Or they have answers that would throw someone under the bus or something, and professionally it would be rude to point out and cause more problems. Or they simply ran into middle ware issues and can't expand on it. Or they realize that no matter what answer they give it won't change anything, and will only drag them deeper into a conversation that can only get worse. I have no idea. The difference between you and I is that you seem to demand more information and I'm fine with dealing with what has been given. Yours is a completely understandable position! I don't want to say it's wrong or anything! I believe 505 is acting in good faith; you deserve a refund, a refund is impossible, the decision had to be and was made to drop native support. I wish my efforts to bring understanding to the situation to Linux and Mac backers were more sucessful and we'll recieved. I feel like they are mostly futile. In the end, it doesn't change the outcome, but I was hoping I could keep you in the community as fans who look forward to playing the game in some other way. Edit: I should also add that post launch refunds are just as impossible then as they are now for the reasons I've said many times now.
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Post by XombieMike on Jan 14, 2019 16:35:35 GMT -6
I made some edits while you were typing, sorry.
Anyways we certainly are on the same side. About "why nothing can or should be done" let me make it clear that I do think something should be done. I've never said anything but that. Now yes though I do believe that something "can't be done" if that something is limited to a refund. I'm open for ideas on other things that might be possible.
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Post by XombieMike on Jan 14, 2019 16:22:39 GMT -6
I don't know what you're talking about, dude. You know you and I are on the same side, right?
Everything in your first two paragraphs, I agree with.
Everything in your last two paragraphs, what the heck? I just don't get you, man.
If your end goal is for them to make it right after launch, consider they may want to do that, but would be extremely foolish to make an expectation or promise about that.
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