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Post by freddythemonkey on Feb 5, 2018 12:40:57 GMT -6
So I'd like to talk about this subject: is there anything in the game that you actually preferred in earlier footage, or even in the first demo we got?I got the idea from reading in some threads (mainly by CastleDan ) about the backgrounds in the very first footage we've seen. I have to agree with Dan's point, being that that particular background looked stunning. Very full of color and "life", and while I appreciated pretty much every other area we've seen so far, I've found nothing that captivating. I can't wait for the areas to surprise me in the final build, but yeah that very first screen looked amazing. They surely have their reason for modifying that particular approach to backgrounds, but it's just for conversational purposes. There are other things I preferred in that first footage: first, the HUD. It clearly needed tweaks to be more practical (numbers are harder to read in intense moments opposed to colored bars), but I loved that style, with HP and MPs scribbled on that piece of paper with the stained glass rose emblem on it. It looked very unique. On the other hand, while I do appreciate the theme of the current HUD (with "potions" representing those parameters, in line with the alchemy theme) it feels much more classic. It's fine, mind you, but that early HUD looked very much like its own thing. Lastly, I loved the Star shaped enemy. We don't know if it was cut from the game, but it behaved like a Medusa head and now that role is fulfilled by Dullahammer's Head. Again, this is not exactly bad, but the Star enemy looked more peculiar and captivating in my eyes. Do you have any similar thought?
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Post by purifyweirdshard on Feb 5, 2018 14:09:51 GMT -6
Well, on Dan's old posts comparing the older builds/pics to what's more recently shown, Angel confirmed to us a while back that those old lighting effects we missed (such as from the IGN screen shots) is back and even refined/improved over what it was. The lighting of the areas seemed to be the main point in the color/life difference, and so that should be back (better, even) from what was said. I tagged CastleDan about that on Discord but I don't know if he saw it. Enkeria was another poster who brought this directly to Angel's attention on a few occasions. I don't think Decarabia (the star enemy) is gone, or that having other "Medusa head"-y enemies in the game precludes him. Floating enemies are more rather a whole genre of monsters than having a couple of reps in a game. It's also a Lesser Key monster, so what may have ended up happening is giving Decarabia a more prominent role or castle assignment. He's a "marquis" in rank, putting him 2-3 tiers above Buer and Amy in the classification. That one bit may/may not have significance though, since Barbatos, Vepar and Gremory are all the same rank at Duke. As for things from before that I personally am missing, I'd say the aura/flower being prominent from the earlier builds. It was reminiscent (though not quite as grand) as Alucard's and other characters' after images while running. We later learned that these things were removed because they clashed with other enhancements or equipment Miriam will receive later, though we've yet to see those. I'd most like to have something similar to what was seen during the 2D characters' movement, but who knows how much of that is feasible. For the UI, I prefer the bars over the numbers, but I do kind of miss Miriam's portrait being there. Maybe we can get some Mana art up there? heh. It'd be kind of neat if her expression changed, too. Not a huge thing for me though. And...for the early-early-early thing, the very first anything we ever saw, I really liked that hallway we saw Miriam run through when the game was very orthographic. The colors and lighting were great, a lot like what Dan's posts were about.
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Post by freddythemonkey on Feb 5, 2018 14:34:13 GMT -6
For the UI, I prefer the bars over the numbers, but I do kind of miss Miriam's portrait being there. Maybe we can get some Mana art up there? heh. It'd be kind of neat if her expression changed, too. Not a huge thing for me though. Classic DooM fashion! Yeah I'm not a big fan of the numbers either, but I would have liked the "potions" incorporated in that "piece of paper", with an emblem or Miriam's portrait. Just a little quirk on the UI. What we have now is classic, however, so I'm fine with that.
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Post by Enkeria on Feb 5, 2018 15:36:58 GMT -6
For the UI, I prefer the bars over the numbers, but I do kind of miss Miriam's portrait being there. Maybe we can get some Mana art up there? heh. It'd be kind of neat if her expression changed, too. Not a huge thing for me though. Classic DooM fashion! Yeah I'm not a big fan of the numbers either, but I would have liked the "potions" incorporated in that "piece of paper", with an emblem or Miriam's portrait. Just a little quirk on the UI. What we have now is classic, however, so I'm fine with that. SOSU and I approve of this message. Mana Ikeda with a few facial expressions would be nice, but I rather see her as a whole in the menu. I could think a 2,5D version of her would do just fine too, if Mana wouldn't feel like doing that extra work to be honest. One can dream though. Cool ideas guys!
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Post by Scars Unseen on Feb 7, 2018 9:49:28 GMT -6
This goes way back, but it would have been interesting to see where IGA might have gone with the hatched shadow shader that he demonstrated in the first round of shader voting. For those who don't recall, here's the screenshots of that shader: Given that one of my few nitpicks about the current direction is the mismatched art style between characters and backgrounds, I can't help but wonder how things might have turned out it a more blatantly stylized shader like crosshatching had been used from the beginning.
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Post by purifyweirdshard on Feb 7, 2018 10:13:37 GMT -6
That's an interesting thought - I think what we have now + the hatched lines might could relieve some of that dissonance, but it's hard to say or imagine. The vote between the two options back then was clear for me just because the hatched lines background looked a bit too flat, grainy and mad the lack of polish on the textures more apparent. The other option had a warmer feel to it and IGA used the "2D" term to describe it, so that was a huge pull. In a different context and with current assets (the character model we have now instead of those old 3D ones), the results may have been different. Here's the update detailing both: Update 33 from 12/2015
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Post by CastleDan on Feb 7, 2018 11:19:21 GMT -6
I saw the lighting comments from Angel and that's exciting but I have to wait and see it for myself. The things I miss are all the effects and just overall polish it seemed to have. You see the giant window back there? It almost has a fog colored hue all around that gives it a lot of needed atmosphere....the lighting really livens up the location. Compare that to this - It looks like all that polish and extra effects/lighting went out the window for a much more abandoned look which is fine but imo doesn't service the game visually as well as the former. I also love how colorful and more 2d the environments looked originally in the test video - As someone else noted I miss the star enemy as it has a lot of character but I'm hoping that maybe it'll be a UNIQUE familiar. ( that's something im hoping for familiars with personality that aren't from enemies in the game )
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Post by purifyweirdshard on Feb 7, 2018 11:21:41 GMT -6
Yeah the test video was what I was referring to in the last line of my comment as well.
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Post by CastleDan on Feb 7, 2018 11:27:44 GMT -6
purifyweirdshard I think the most frustrating part for me is that a test video done in a short time gets the feel I wanted out of this more than extensive production time has. The enjoyment that comes from an IGAVANIA for me is exploring a very cool castle with good layout and visuals. So when the castle has issues in one or both of those areas it takes a big hit for me. My favorite Vania's were the ones with the best castle design funny enough. It's my only real criticism of the game so far which is a good thing and bad since that aspect is big for me.
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