Pure Miriam
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Post by Pure Miriam on May 4, 2016 4:22:50 GMT -6
You are Miriam, an orphan scarred by an alchemist curse which slowly crystallizes your skin. You must battle your way through a demon-filled castle summoned by Gebel, your old friend whose body has become more crystal than flesh.I want to discuss the plot. So, in order to do this properly, i made some basic questions so we have something to start with. The picture is just to illustrate, i don't like long posts with no pictures! About the Ritual:
- Mirian and Gebel where sacrifices for demons to appear and fest or they where beacons for demons to get attracted for and follow their commands? What was the ritual?
- What the Alchemist's Guld would do if everything worked perfectly?
- Do you think the Guild has any survivor besides Johannes?
About the Magi-Crystal Curse:
- Miriam's heart was crystalized but Gebel's heart stays intact. What is the meaning of this?
- Do you think the curse has any hidden effect that we don't know yet?
About Miriam:
- Miriam was something "special" to be used at tje ritual?
- What do you think will be Miriam's ultimate fate?
About Johannes:
- What is Johannes's role on all of this? He will be an advisor/shop/quest giver, or will have a more, relevant role at the plot?
- Johannes is an Alchemist and (apparently) the sole survivor of Gebel's massacre. He had philosophical differences with the Guild. Do you think he may have some secret agenda? (For good or for Bad).
About Gebel:
- Gebel was the primary option for the ritual. Why? He was already something "special" to be used?
- What is Gebel's plan, right now?
- Do you think Gebel will be the final villian or there may be something higher than him at the plot?
About Zangetsu:
- Zangetsu is a Demon Hunter. He hunted demons during those 10 years Miriam stayed in a coma (when they appeared) or do you think there was demons before this?
- Zangetsu will, definitely, have contact with the other characters. Gebel is evil, but how he will see Miriam? As a friend or foe, due to her powers?
Okey, let's start speculating! EDITED TO CORRECT SOME MISTAKES.
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Post by allooutrick on May 4, 2016 7:47:13 GMT -6
The alchemists are probably depicted as a group bent on world domination but we'll see later on that they actually wanted a never ending supply of stones for engagement rings. Inhumane are their methods but apparently quite effective with some, magical, side effects.
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Post by lai on May 4, 2016 13:00:02 GMT -6
Some points I would like to make: - The curse victims were never intended to be sacrifices just beacons for the demons or rather an incentive for the demons to leave hell
- Gebel was to first one to be afflicted with the curse as he was the original host for the curse.
- According to the Kickstarter, Johannes is the only survivor of the Alchemists guild because he was nice to Gebel and Miriam and he was against the plan
- The alchemists wanted to bring demons to the earth to stop the industrial revolution from taking hold. The rest of the details are on the Kickstarter. Long story short, they wanted to stay relevant.
Here are my speculations: - Gebel has no real plan as of the game's events outside of being a generic doomsday villain. Sane Gebel probably just wanted to make a safe haven for him and Miriam.
- Going off of that, hosts to the curse are ostracized, discriminated, and actively sought out by lynch mobs as they are seen as bad omens. (well they aren't wrong)
- Miriam is going to fall completely under the curse's influence a la Gebel only to escape it through
plot bs willpower/friendship. (I hope I'm wrong on this one because it's been done to death.) - If we are going for sequel hooks either Miriam or Gebel is gonna get dragged to hell. (my money's on Gebel, I bet 100 Zimbabwe dollars)
- Gebel curbstomped the alchemists guild during Miriam's curse ritual making it so that it was only a part of heart that was crystallized; this is also why she went into a coma and Gebel didn't.
- If the above isn't true and Gebel wiped the alchemists guild after the ritual then the sheer shock and difficulty of the ritual caused Miriam's coma.
- Going off of the above Gebel destroyed the guild for Miriam
- Crystallizing the heart is much, much harder than crystallizing the skin. As a result Miriam, the last person to undergo this ritual, is the only one with a part-crystal heart
- Zangetsu hunted demons before Miriam's coma but moved to England with his fellow
redshirts demon hunters because of the greater demand for demon hunters there. In short: economics.
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Pure Miriam
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Post by Pure Miriam on May 4, 2016 15:01:24 GMT -6
Some points I would like to make: - The curse victims were never intended to be sacrifices just beacons for the demons or rather an incentive for the demons to leave hell
- Gebel was to first one to be afflicted with the curse as he was the original host for the curse.
- According to the Kickstarter, Johannes is the only survivor of the Alchemists guild because he was nice to Gebel and Miriam and he was against the plan
- The alchemists wanted to bring demons to the earth to stop the industrial revolution from taking hold. The rest of the details are on the Kickstarter. Long story short, they wanted to stay relevant.
Large parts of the plot aren't fully confirmed, but i editted the starting post to make it better. Thanks for that! About the rest you said, IGA normally has a script that waves between some overused tropes and cliches, with new spice here and there. So, i do think Gebel will be a classic downsday villian, but i also think that some plot twist is at hand, like he not being the main villian or Johannes revealing a secret agenda.
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Post by arct1c0n on May 4, 2016 15:46:23 GMT -6
Gebel turns out to be gay and is just going through an emo phase with too much power on his hands once Miriam smacks the crap out of him for awhile with a Fashion Today magazine and then sends him to Scottsdale as punishment
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Post by crocodile on May 5, 2016 12:43:13 GMT -6
Game Start - Miriam wakes up from her coma or whatever and Johannes fills her on what is going on
- Gebel's castle appears and Miriam enters it
- Gebel and Miriam meet and he monologues about how he's doing the right thing and the alchemists/World deserve punishment then leaves
- Miriam storms the castle beating back the enemies and meeting other noteworthy characters with their own goals (Zangetsu, etc.)
- Miriam confronts Gebel for the final confrontation and then one of three things happen:
Scenario A - Miriam & Gebel fight.
- Gebel dies and Miriam leaves thinking she defeated/averted a great evil
- Castle falls apart and credits roll
Scenario B - Miriam and Gebel fight. Miriam wins and its revealed Gebel actually had alternate (good or bad) intentions for Miriam behind his actions
- These intentions are revealed and lead to Miriam supplanting Gebel (either she succumbs to the curse becoming a full demon and rules the castle as an evil queen, or the castle becomes a new peaceful home for her, etc.)
- Castle remains intact and credits roll
Scenario C - Miriam and Gebel fight. Miriam wins and its revealed Gebel actually had good intentions behind his actions - trying to stop a greater evil
- Johannes shows up, takes off his glasses, slicks back his hair and reveals he was the mastermind behind EVERYTHING.
- More of the castle opens up (or perhaps even a second one) and you make your way through it
- Fight and defeat Johannes
- The TRUE EVIL (Satan? Cthulhu? Etc.) appears
- You fight. You win. Castle falls apart and credits roll
Leave some plausible dangling plot threads at the end for a sequel and you're set to go
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Post by CastleDan on May 5, 2016 13:14:26 GMT -6
I always saw the game having a main enemy that is actually satan. I'll still miss the dracula angle because he's such a cool gothic figure but I really do feel the game needs a main villain that is bound by some nature of reality. ( in the sense that it's something not completely made up within the games story)
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Post by Goobsausage on May 5, 2016 15:10:40 GMT -6
I always saw the game having a main enemy that is actually satan. I'll still miss the dracula angle because he's such a cool gothic figure but I really do feel the game needs a main villain that is bound by some nature of reality. ( in the sense that it's something not completely made up within the games story) Having Satan as a main enemy is an ambitious idea. It's one of the things I liked about Lords of Shadow (and felt Jason Isaacs was a good match to play him), but felt they dropped the ball. I think it'd be neat if IGA took the same idea and did it his way. As for other ideas... Ever since I saw him during the Bloodstained Kickstarter, I had a feeling Johannes would have some sort of Vince McMahon or Reverse Flash "It was me, Miriam! I did the bad thing all along!" villain reveal or betrayal scene. I'd be more surprised if he was a good guy all along. I think the game will have Gebel end up becoming a Dracula-style main villain for the series and this game will be his origin story, but with more of a "What has science done? What hath mankind wrought?" angle with alchemy than a supernatural one. I can see Zangetsu and Miriam's relationship growing into one similar to Snake and Meryl from MGS1 or Ron and April from Parks and Rec where there's a grumpy older mentor and a younger rookie. Maybe they'll be some moments where Zangetsu tries to understand Miriam as a shade of grey between humans and demons, similar to how older people try to cope with things that are new or unfamiliar to them. I remember looking Zangetsu's design for the first time and getting the impression he'd be a heavy drinker. I'd like to see a scene where Zangetsu offers Miriam some beer, wine, or another other alcoholic beverage to see how she'd react, and secretly hoping she'd enjoy it so they could have something to at least bond over if he doesn't quite understand her.
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Post by Shax on May 5, 2016 16:27:59 GMT -6
Hmm...a fine set of questions indeed.
Ritual -I don't really think they were supposed to be sacrifices. I'd say they were supposed to be more like "remote controls." I don't really see why a demon would have to take orders from a human unless that human has power over them.
-Another question would be why the alchemist would try to summon demons anyways. Personally, I think they did it to "reestablish" themselves. Considering the time period Bloodstained takes place it, a lose in faith in magic wouldn't be surprising. Well, if you can control an army of demons...you can do pretty much whatever you want.
-Why did there even have to be a ritual in the first place? From what I can tell, Gebel was able to summon a horde of them without much problem.
Magi-Crystal Curse -Miriam may have been picked because she was "ripe" and "disposable." Considering the fact she was in a coma-like state for 10 years we can assume that they really couldn't have used a person that was too old. A child would be a tender age if they were chosen. Now, let's also remember the fact that Miriam is an orphan so nobody would really notice her disappearance if they were to fail and accidentally kill her. (Now I made myself sad)
-Since we've yet to see what a "full-body" curse looks like, I would assume that is the secret. Gebel might transform into this in the game considering how close the curse is to engulfing his entire body.
-Also, have you noticed that the marks on Gebel's body are much darker and red than the ones on Miriam's? The same effect can be seen in the picture of Miriam when the curse starts to spread. It may just be for effect though.
Miriam -I feel like she was just convenient to use. She was but a child when they picked her up.
Johannes -I think he's pretty suspicious to be honest. He'll probably fit more an "advisior" role most likely.
Gebel -Given the way he reacted, I highly doubt he participated willing. However, he could have volunteered and wanted to back out when he learned of what could become of him. His feelings and the alchemist themselves probably accelerated the curse so it took over rather quickly.
-I don't think Gebel even knows what he is doing now. He had good intentions at first but...those were quickly lost in the echo.
-I think he'll be a final villain in one of the endings. If he is the real threat or not, I have no idea.
Zangetsu -I would be surprised if he was a boss or mini-boss. I can only guess parts of his personality through what little I know. However, he definitely doesn't strike me was the forgiving type, especially since he lost his arm, eye, and a lot of his friends. My vote is that he'll just attack Miriam and Johannes because they are alchemist who brought the demons there in the first place.
Overall, I feel like most of the story will be unraveled via cut-scenes and in-game items. The enemies, themselves, would probably give an insight of what truly happened. I mean, the "Morte" looks like it could have been another living creature before it became what it is.
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Pure Miriam
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[TI1] "A new, vital heart, pulsing with the old blood." -IGA
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Post by Pure Miriam on May 6, 2016 15:02:28 GMT -6
I think it could be fun if Gebel is, in fact, the true villian of the game. The curse consumes him and he turns into a living immortal demon (not a dead one, like a vampire). So, he could be Bloodstained's "Dracula". A crystalized all-mighty powerful demonic alchemist that never dies and can summon demons and castles. The game's event could kickstart a legion of demon hunters (instead of Vampire Hunters, as on Castlevania) trained to beat him, his demons and maybe a sect of followers.
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Post by crocodile on May 6, 2016 15:47:55 GMT -6
For some reason I could also imagine them going the route of Gabriel Belmont in the Lords of Shadow series and set up Miriam to become the villain or villain protagonist for the series as a whole. Lord of Shadows was not a good series but I thought that was an interesting way to handle the narrative. Not a lot of series have villain protagonists or heroes who become villains over time. Would certainly be more interesting to me, if done well of course, than just making Gebel the defacto villian.
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