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Post by Dvv on Aug 20, 2015 11:01:34 GMT -6
I always loved it in Castlevania games like CV4/Lament of Innocence/Harmony of Despair when you could use your whip get around. Order of Eccesia had the right idea with Magnes points too. While I would love to see whip platforming to make a return I could see that being tricky as you might not always have a whip weapon on you, unless you have a whip item/ability that is only used for swinging, maybe some kind of spirit/soul whip that forms when you want to use it on whipping points. Or maybe Miriam could use her chain skill as a whip for these points. This thread is specifically for weapon/ability based ways to get around, not double jumping/air dashing/flight. What other ideas can you guys come up with for unique ways to platform? Any special abilities come to mind?
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wiggychiggy
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Post by wiggychiggy on Aug 20, 2015 11:25:08 GMT -6
I really enjoyed the simplicity of the Magnes point mechanics in OoE. However, if the grapple mechanic is anything like Axiom Verge--where it is simply a grapple hook that can attach to any ceiling tile--I would want it to be tested extensively. The reason Magnes was so effective in my opinion was it's ease of use. There was no need to make a pin-point accurate jump or aim for a small grapple point in the environment. Simply throw out your Magnes field in the general area of the point and you're latched on.
Now this is coming from a man who had difficulty nailing down the bionic arm mechanic in the original Bionic Commando game when I was younger, so I'm certain I'm biased from that experience. I enjoy a good platforming element in my games just like anyone else, so I would enjoy seeing some kind of interesting mechanic involved. IGA mentioned an element that didn't jive with another game that he had developed in the past--it was a giant hand that emerged from the back of the player character to help them scale walls. Could you imagine Miriam sprouting crystallized spider's legs from the tattoo on her back to help her scale specialized wall tiles? It would be a new take on an old mechanic which I think is the guiding principle of Bloodstained: Ritual of the Night at this point.
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Post by Dvv on Aug 20, 2015 11:30:41 GMT -6
IGA mentioned an element that didn't jive with another game that he had developed in the past--it was a giant hand that emerged from the back of the player character to help them scale walls. Could you imagine Miriam sprouting crystallized spider's legs from the tattoo on her back to help her scale specialized wall tiles? It would be a new take on an old mechanic which I think is the guiding principle of Bloodstained: Ritual of the Night at this point. Having special ways to climb walls would sound super fun. It also sounds like it would be a good way to aim projectiles at enemies/bosses that are just outside of your normal range. Its a shame you didn't have a good experience with Bionic Commando, I really enjoyed the remake.
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Post by wiggychiggy on Aug 20, 2015 11:36:39 GMT -6
Oh yes, you're absolutely right! I hadn't even thought of that.With that in mind perhaps there could be giant sized bosses which span multiple screens or have multiple parts which Miriam must defeat individually. Scaling the tower that contains the beast as she goes!
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Post by Goobsausage on Aug 20, 2015 12:40:02 GMT -6
Like Dvv suggested, I am down for having a grappling mechanic. I don't really have anything to elaborate with other than how I think grappling is fun and I think it would be cool to see Iga include it in Bloodstained since I don't remember it being in any of his older games. Maybe Miriam could have some sort of mechanical grappling hook. I dunno. Just tossing ideas here. I also think it would be cool to have crystals come out of Miriam's body like with wiggychiggy's spider leg example. I think I'd like to take that idea and run with it for a bit. A technique that I think would be cool is if there was some sort of speed boost or running jump technique similar to the one from the Metroid games, but using Miriam's crystals. What I'm thinking of is something similar to what the villain from "Big Hero 6" had with the microbots. Instead of just seeing Miriam run fast, she gets a running start, then the animation changes to her body going limp as crystals start coming out of her body, quickly pushing her in the direction she's facing, and they could launch her into the air when the player pushes the jump button.
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Post by Dvv on Aug 20, 2015 13:04:51 GMT -6
Oh yes, you're absolutely right! I hadn't even thought of that.With that in mind perhaps there could be giant sized bosses which span multiple screens or have multiple parts which Miriam must defeat individually. Scaling the tower that contains the beast as she goes! A giant boss like Menace comes to mind.
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purifyweirdshard
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Post by purifyweirdshard on Aug 20, 2015 13:27:13 GMT -6
No idea how many of you may/may not have played Valkyrie Profile 1/2, but a central platforming mechanic in that game was actually creation of crystals on surfaces or aimed at enemies to freeze them in place. The square button fired a projectile that did these things.
Crystal options in VP1: Single crystal: One placed on the floor. Can be shot again with the projectile to double its size, making a slightly larger platform to make jumps on. Can be broken into pieces, which can then be picked up, thrown, or set down on top of existing crystals to stack a higher platform. Larger crystal: The one that requires two shots. Breaks into more pieces and can be shot a third time to create a temporary, floating platform of tiny crystal shards in the air. This was the only way to make certain jumps. It was invisible unless you were standing on it. If you fire the third projectile while on top of the large crystal, it flings you quickly far away.
In the second game, it was a bit different. Crystals only effected enemies, but once they were encapsulated, shooting them again caused them and the main character to switch places, also giving you another jump. So, you could crystalize one enemy, jump on it, and then freeze and switch places with a flying enemy to get to a high platform.
I'd love to see one/all of these uses of crystals incorporated somehow into Bloodstained since I'm such a fan of those games (and they're apparently not making another one), and I think it could prove interesting and useful in this game.
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gunlord500
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Post by gunlord500 on Aug 20, 2015 15:10:03 GMT -6
Gravity reversal/stage rotation might be fun.
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Post by Dragon_of_Dojima on Aug 20, 2015 15:31:45 GMT -6
For this very reason, among others, this is why I am so pro-whip to this day. Unique platforming keeps things interesting. Super Castlevania 4 almost did it perfectly. Bloodlines had the right idea with the super jump and whip swinging angles to a lesser extent.
As I said in another thread, I'd love to have wall jumping. There could even be a boss to test your skill in wall jumping or whip swinging. Guacamelee had all sorts of platforming puzzles, but let's hope this game won't take that game's love of spikes too. :S
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Post by Rigel on Aug 20, 2015 17:55:48 GMT -6
I like the idea of scaling the walls and the whip mechanic to swing and to ascend and descend infinitely too.
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Post by Dvv on Aug 20, 2015 21:16:20 GMT -6
Gravity reversal/stage rotation might be fun. I actually thought of stage rotation when wiggychiggy suggested spider legs to go up walls, like when you reach a wall you start walking on it and the view of the stage rotates. As cool as that sounds I didn't mention it because I thought it would be a bit impractical and would change the dynamic of the game a bit too much.
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Post by ArthurSixx on Aug 20, 2015 21:58:48 GMT -6
How about being able to unlock dedicated environmental tools to traverse otherwise impossible platforms? Like, for example, an ice pick for climbing an ice wall or climbing claws for normal walls (areas out of reach for a high jump).
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Dvv
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Post by Dvv on Aug 22, 2015 0:56:56 GMT -6
How about being able to unlock dedicated environmental tools to traverse otherwise impossible platforms? Like, for example, an ice pick for climbing an ice wall or climbing claws for normal walls (areas out of reach for a high jump). I wouldn't be opposed to something like this.
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Post by Astaroth on Aug 22, 2015 9:44:20 GMT -6
actually that gives me a few ideas for variations of those, like with a wall jump/ice climb relic an animation sequence where she leaps at a wall and clawed hands/spindly spikes come from her back and digs into the wall to initiate wall slide and when she jumps off the arms vault her upwards giving it a magical feel instead of just simply "screw the rules, i have green hair" like most wall jumps are >P or a relic that grants double jump giving her aura wings for a second (yes like alucards DJ but i cant think of any other way to do it really besides an aura jetpack i think dodge/dash should be mundane and either available at start or acquired early, but an enhancement relic later on that makes your dodge/dash slightly better and much cooler looking with spindly legs and gives you a speed booster ability where your run stages up to spindly legs coming out of your back and taking up the running while miriam panther souls along although, a magnes style launch ability could come in handy for a stage where youre maneuvering and dodging falling steel balls through a giant pachinko machine... OF EVIL!!! >3
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Post by Togposh on Aug 22, 2015 14:30:36 GMT -6
I would be cool to see like a second weapon or ability used for things other then fighting like in other castlevania games.
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Post by xxxcbenn on Aug 22, 2015 23:14:18 GMT -6
I like the way the whip was used in super Castlevania for the Super Nintendo.
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Post by Zangetsu on Aug 22, 2015 23:20:40 GMT -6
I like the way the whip was used in super Castlevania for the Super Nintendo. I was playing that with a friend today and I totally agree with this comment! They whip was quite dynamic and fun in Super Castlevania IV~
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purifyweirdshard
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Post by purifyweirdshard on Aug 24, 2015 7:03:11 GMT -6
That really only works with a whip as the main/only weapon in the game, though. It kind of obsoletes everything else and/or would necessitate changing the difficulty or enemy placement. Obviously, swinging a half screen whip 8 directions that can also be used for mobility/platforming would be preferable to swinging a standard sword that's just a little longer than half the character's height. I think it could be a good option for other modes/a different character, assuming they're limited in another way.
I personally prefer the standard straight forward attack only. Having that assumes a certain kind of enemy waves/placement. I don't really want things flying at me in all directions in an Igavania game...we're going to be indoors with higher mobility than the Super Nintendo days, so I don't think it will be all that necessary.
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Post by Dvv on Aug 25, 2015 16:55:28 GMT -6
That really only works with a whip as the main/only weapon in the game, though. Which is why in the opening post I said "While I would love to see whip platforming to make a return I could see that being tricky as you might not always have a whip weapon on you, unless you have a whip item/ability that is only used for swinging, maybe some kind of spirit/soul whip that forms when you want to use it on whipping points. Or maybe Miriam could use her chain skill as a whip for these points." This eliminates the need of having an actual whip equipped.
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Post by blankslatenator on Jan 8, 2017 11:47:38 GMT -6
Multiple Layers of platforming similar to Muramasa, where you are running on a path, but can jump down to a not shown second layer river and find hiddenish goodies, really helped prevent immediate linearity.
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