Feedback Poll: Should Mac/Linux users be offered refunds?

When I backed the game, I never thought myself as buying the game. I thought of it more like "investing in a startup" that is developing a product that may or may not come to life. We paid for something that wasn't a finished product, i.e., vaporware. It's kind of like if you invest in a business that ultimately failed for legitimate and legal reasons. You can't get a refund for that.

I see and feel both sides of this coin.

I wish for the best on all our behalfs.

Its all in the phrasing, Try to rename the topic but maintain the same idea.

"Should you get a refund when the producer won't provide with the product you paid for?"

Hi jph here. Lookie, you finally have an account to issue ban threats at if you don't like what I say.

I am not a lawyer. I will stick again to restating what we do know. 505 themselves have invoked the KS TOS as the reason they can bypass their reward obligation.

In any case, the fall back is common law, which there is plenty of precedent that KS projects can be held liable for refunds for unmet reward promises. Even if they claim they don't have any money that just pushes them into bankruptcy proceedings at which point remaining assets are used to pay off liabilities in order of priority.

Now let me propose a hypothetical, say I started a business in the following way:

1) I create limited liability company A
2) company A takes out a loan debt of 100K
3) I create limited liability company B
4) company A pays company B to produce widgets
5) company B buys a yacht
6) I bankrupt company A thus escaping 100K debt.

Does anyone think there isn't common law covering this situation? Well, this is the situation we find ourselves in, only in this case the yacht is a switch port. Not part of the KS but worth a lot of money to Artplay/505.

absorbnix
I've never threatened you. I suggested you register so you can edit your posts. Jeez dude, you're so hostile. Like your mouth works fine but your ears are broken. Anyway, I'm glad you registered. I hope you find a purpose for being here that isn't just repeating yourself and refusing to understand the situation.

Your mention of bankruptcy or lack of money is silly. The project has its budget. It's that simple. The KS funds that were raised for development have been spent long ago to various parties to make what they have made or are making, and everything else is being continued by 505's budget for the game. This isn't the first time you've heard this though is it? So why should I keep repeating myself to you?

Nothing is going to change the fact that I feel like refunds to Linux and Mac backers is the moral thing to do, and nothing is going to change that they can't refund the money or they would. However, that doesn't mean I can't get tired of individuals that just come here to spout vile snide remarks and fail to move this conversation anywhere.

Look, do you actually want to get something done? Have you tried everything you can? Because all you're seeming to be doing now is pushing me who thinks you deserve a refund into being me who thinks you are unreasonable and toxic.

These aren't threats. These are just my insights. I enforce rules, not pick and choose who to "censor, threaten or silence". This isn't my profession. I'm a volunteer. Professionally, I don't speak for anything. Personally, I'm sick of your attitude.

Get something done.

I would have loved to rally the community to back a refund and distribute the money myself. I've ran a couple of fan donation events and have handled fan money on two sucessful occasions. If anyone could start a fan campaign to get Linux and Mac backers some money back, it would be me. (Feel free to prove me wrong, and continue to just whine about stuff or empty threat legal action.)

Asking for money from the rest of fans like me who think you deserve a refund has a great chance of sucess due to overwhelming stance from all backers that you do indeed deserve a refund. The huge catch there is how you prevent non backers, or non Linux / Mac backers from taking advantage of that good will.

I have worked with Fangamer behind the scenes for various minor reasons in the past for Bloodstained and they have always been very responsive. I approached them with this idea of a fan campaign to refund Linux / Mac backers. I asked that if I were to get them a list of claims if they could verify them. They did not respond to me, and that is very uncharacteristic of them. What that helps confirm for me is that they have no way to tell Linux / Mac backers from Windows backers, and a refund would be opened to everyone. No staff has ever denied this and no survey choices for platforms have ever had Linux or Mac on it specifically.

So a crowd funding campaign to get you your pledge back isn't going to happen. The same thing is an obstacle for knowing who is legally verifiably due a refund, which is null anyway because no one is legally due a refund. Go get a lawyer if you disagree, but I think that's a bad idea for you and everyone. Regardless, your snide comments and attitude here certainly aren't going to change anything in a positive way.

Since you like making up hypothetical stories, here's one for you. Let's say we actually do crowd fund a refund campaign and discover the amount of claims are low enough we can judge on an individual basis these are legit backers, for the legit platforms, with the legit amounts pledged. Wouldn't it be funny as hell that they actually still get Steam keys or switch platforms, get their backer rewards, and end up playing it on WINE just fine?

What is your goal here, and how long do you plan on doing something about it other than stinking up this place?

(Written on my tiny phone. Sorry for typos.)

I agree with this. If the refund matters that much to anyone, rally together and get a lawyer to represent your case.

No one wants to see the project fail. I haven't seen a single person say that, least of all Linux backers who wish they had a version for their platform.

All I've seen is people standing up and saying that Linux backers also count. That there is no justification that can be offered for taking our money but not keeping their promise.

Challenge us on that, anyway you want; ethical, logical, emotional. You think you know things about the situation? Well I think I do as well. Every excuse will be invalidated, every rampart breached, every fallacy exploited.

It is not acceptable conduct, no matter how you dress it up or what pretty words are offered up. If any of these reasons were valid they would promise to make it right after launch, which they have declined to do.