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Post by allooutrick on Aug 14, 2017 8:42:36 GMT -6
I think it would be great if it was roughly ten rooms large. The devs could get incredibly sneaky and require Miriam to wear an accessory as she enters a certain area. For example, if the boat lands at the castle then she could go inside the boat again. If she goes back in with this accessory equipped then she'll enter the retro level. This could also be a nod to the secret level at the entrance of SotN that players needed to glitch through the ground to reach.
I'd like for the level itself and sounds to be retro but I won't mind if Miriam, enemies, shards, etc remain as they are.
Lastly a reward for players who find this secret would be good. It'll be fun in it's own way to stumble on this but a unique shard or two would be preferred.
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Post by CastleDan on Aug 14, 2017 9:00:56 GMT -6
Hopefully they give us enough of the 2D , I hope it's not a single room. I want to get that nostalgic feeling like we've finally gotten our 2D consolevania.
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Enkeria
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Post by Enkeria on Aug 14, 2017 10:01:22 GMT -6
Woah man, I was just making a loose connection, no reason to get riled up over Death being out. Like my answer to PM's big question thread, he's the one enemy/boss I want back the most, and for him to talk some trash like he always does... I do/will respect their wishes to separate themselves and stand on their own. Just as much though, I want those old 'vania things. It's tough. I think what bugs me about it is that it's already pretty much a Castlevania clone. If you didn't show me the name of this game and I didn't know about the kickstarter i'd say it's a brand new Castlevania title. So it seems strange to want to distance themselves while still largely making quite a similar game. For me what's wrong with making public domain type monsters? They wouldn't be able to sue for that...and people want their castlevania so giving us something we've wanted isn't bad. That doesn't mean they have to utilize these enemies in the exact same ways....like the medusa enemies don't have to be floating heads, or the skeletons don't have to throw bones, or Dracula/Grim Reaper don't have to function the same way as they did before. That's just how I look at it, to me I say they go all in...... if Konami won't give us what we want then let me throw money at whoever will. Death itself must have more important things to do than fly around, speaking to people. Vampires, skeletons, mermen.. These guys could come back as a really unique re-design. How about actual Vampires, being a bit like smart ghouls, turning into bats. Then we have 2 enemies in one. Skeletons could be from some kind of other animal than man this time, how about Werewolf skeletons? (Don't know if Castlevania have those). Or a skeleton from one of Solomon's Demons, like. Criss-cross the things and you get unique results. Change the pattern and how they engage in combat. Stuff like that CAN make a huuuuge difference. |
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Post by CastleDan on Aug 14, 2017 11:31:41 GMT -6
I think what bugs me about it is that it's already pretty much a Castlevania clone. If you didn't show me the name of this game and I didn't know about the kickstarter i'd say it's a brand new Castlevania title. So it seems strange to want to distance themselves while still largely making quite a similar game. For me what's wrong with making public domain type monsters? They wouldn't be able to sue for that...and people want their castlevania so giving us something we've wanted isn't bad. That doesn't mean they have to utilize these enemies in the exact same ways....like the medusa enemies don't have to be floating heads, or the skeletons don't have to throw bones, or Dracula/Grim Reaper don't have to function the same way as they did before. That's just how I look at it, to me I say they go all in...... if Konami won't give us what we want then let me throw money at whoever will. Death itself must have more important things to do than fly around, speaking to people. Vampires, skeletons, mermen.. These guys could come back as a really unique re-design. How about actual Vampires, being a bit like smart ghouls, turning into bats. Then we have 2 enemies in one. Skeletons could be from some kind of other animal than man this time, how about Werewolf skeletons? (Don't know if Castlevania have those). Or a skeleton from one of Solomon's Demons, like. Criss-cross the things and you get unique results. Change the pattern and how they engage in combat. Stuff like that CAN make a huuuuge difference. Exactly. There could have been creative ways to handle them - like my stained glass skeleton idea.  Anyways, do we know how detailed this retro stage is supposed to look? 8-bit/16-bit/ 32-bit? 32 would be so sick. |
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Enkeria
Silver in the Dark
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Post by Enkeria on Aug 14, 2017 11:35:50 GMT -6
Exactly. There could have been creative ways to handle them - like my stained glass skeleton idea. Anyways, do we know how detailed this retro stage is supposed to look? 8-bit/16-bit/ 32-bit? 32 would be so sick. Skeleton made out of glass would sound more like glass, and less like bones when destroyed. Do you really want that? They have mentioned 8 and 16, but it leans towards 16. This do NOT however change the fact that there could be a blend of many different kinds of effects. I think 16 would be the feel for it when looking on pictures. The core design would feel like 16. The graphical effects attached would give us 32 feel, the game-layout and music might be a nod towards 8 bit. To put in other words, we are probably in for a ride! |
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Post by CastleDan on Aug 14, 2017 12:25:53 GMT -6
Exactly. There could have been creative ways to handle them - like my stained glass skeleton idea. Anyways, do we know how detailed this retro stage is supposed to look? 8-bit/16-bit/ 32-bit? 32 would be so sick. Skeleton made out of glass would sound more like glass, and less like bones when destroyed. Do you really want that? They have mentioned 8 and 16, but it leans towards 16. This do NOT however change the fact that there could be a blend of many different kinds of effects. I think 16 would be the feel for it when looking on pictures. The core design would feel like 16. The graphical effects attached would give us 32 feel, the game-layout and music might be a nod towards 8 bit. To put in other words, we are probably in for a ride!Sounding more like glass is better than sounding squishy like every morte we've seen so far which is NOTHING like a skeleton. Glass is more characteristic because it has a BREAKING sound and a hard exterior. Here's hoping it's not 8-bit. |
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Post by Enkeria on Aug 14, 2017 12:56:38 GMT -6
Skeleton made out of glass would sound more like glass, and less like bones when destroyed. Do you really want that? They have mentioned 8 and 16, but it leans towards 16. This do NOT however change the fact that there could be a blend of many different kinds of effects. I think 16 would be the feel for it when looking on pictures. The core design would feel like 16. The graphical effects attached would give us 32 feel, the game-layout and music might be a nod towards 8 bit. To put in other words, we are probably in for a ride!Sounding more like glass is better than sounding squishy like every morte we've seen so far which is NOTHING like a skeleton. Glass is more characteristic because it has a BREAKING sound and a hard exterior. Here's hoping it's not 8-bit. A skeleton with shard attached.. Best of both worlds? Yeah, I am pretty sure it will be such a blend in "bits" haha, that we can't say its either this or that, and just roll with "it got the retro feel alright!". |
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Post by Galamoth on Aug 14, 2017 20:01:21 GMT -6
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Post by CastleDan on Aug 14, 2017 21:26:01 GMT -6
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Post by LeoLeWolferoux on Aug 14, 2017 22:56:24 GMT -6
Retro Level"One section of the castle will feature an area that Miriam can traverse in beautiful retro graphics. We've been referring to this section as the “8-bit Level” internally, although it may be closer to 16+ bit depending on how we mix it with the full game. While a full-blown 8-bit game doesn't fit into the game's budget, backer support will allow us to have fun with the development and create a little retro magic in our game." - Update 2 - May 14 2015 - Source
Classic Mode will give us stages, linear adventure and a 'Castlevania'-feel from the old days before the RPG-elements were introduced. Inti-Creates development for the prequel will be a complete 'Classic / Modern' game with probably a combination of the best aspects from both Castlevania, Metroid and Igavania, with an Inti-Creates twist. Meanwhile the actual main game will have a Retro Level inside of it. Perhaps a hidden room, or special odd room or an corridor of some sorts. This thread is about the Retro Level, not to be confused with either Classic Mode or Bloodstained - Ritual of the Night prequel.
What do you expect to see in this environment / area of which will be a "Retro Level"?
...Soma Cruz...
I-I MEAN I hope to see items from past IGAvania games...! And maybe enemies...? (Yeah, that sounds good.) ^^
Whole Section? Small Room? Big Room???
Do you think it will be a complete section of the map, for example, instead of going to the "Garden of the Unbound", you end up in "The Lost Arena" which have many different locations attached to it? Everything from a bigger area to a corridor some rooms before you exit the place and goes back to "normal" again? Small Room?
Do you think it is perhaps just one room, where there is no need for a door of any kind, the transition from one frame to another would be fine since there are less for the game engine to process once you get close to that room. If so, what will the room contain? Would it have a tribute of some kind? Will it have a pixelated version of something you have seen before in the game? Perhaps it is a room with nothing but just cool backgrounds, like paintings and information? Big Room?
Or, do you think the retro level will be one big room (2x3 or 2x2) with lots of floors and details, showing all kinds of things, even have unique (or remade) enemies?I imagine it'll be it's own stage, or shall we say, portion of the castle. I can't imagine it would be very large though~Assets
Do you think Inti-Creates will borrow their assets for making this level in Bloodstained - RotN connected to the prequel, or would you rather see IGA take charge in that area, making a, what we would believe, his vision of Miriam and the environment if he could have gathered enough pixel-artists to actually make the whole game in that fashion?I suppose it doesn't really matter to me. Whatever direction the art style takes isn't a problem to me, and IGA probably wants to try something new. so having INTI-CREATES in charge of it really just makes sense to me.Rules
Think about it, there are some creative freedoms in this, the rules are almost out of the window. The movement, the backdrop philosophy (having it darker than the forground) and behaviours are all within those rules. Example. Will same breakable things be breakable? Are the speed the same? Same sounds or not? Are there something different in this area, or would it be like the rest of the game except for the graphics? And speaking of rules...
I'm sure the 'Retro' level will follow the same recipes the handheld IGAvanias did.
Shards
Lastly, how will the shards work in this level? Will they look 2,5 D? Will Miriam be LOCKED so she can't use any shards in this are, leaving us to believe it will be a cursed environment of some kind? Perhaps there will be a pixel-filter on-top of any of the shards we are using?
Fun ideas, but it'll probably function just like Aria Of Sorrow. 
Let me know!
Mostly what you think, and add in what you really want to see as well.
Aaaahh...I would love to hear music in the style of Castlevania: Circle Of The Moon, or even Castlevania: Harmony Of Dissonance. <3
Ala this:
Thanks to Pure Miriam for the inspiration of this thread. |
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Post by Pure Miriam on Aug 15, 2017 1:31:52 GMT -6
About the whole "Why IGA don't use Dracula / Death / Skeletons" discussion.
I don't like to be the one to break people's hopes, although i believe we have a chance of IGA using something like that (Bloodless is a vampire) i firmly believe, and hope, he doesn't use it.
The thing some people must understand is that spiritual sucessor and carbon copy are two different things.
A spiritual sucessor is a game that borrows the same feel, gameplay and overall structure from a past game, without copying it to the bone. It's not about Konami trying to sue IGA for plagiarism (although that is also not impossible) is about creating a new IP that is not just a carbon copy of what you worked before.
Dracula, Death and such are public domain enemies, that's right. But the game is already looking dangerously close to a Castlevania. Adding all that would make it so similar that IGA could be accused of lack of creativity. You guys don't think the man can do something different then that? That he can't create a villian as cool as Dracula for himself? Or a sidekick as menacing as Death?
I believe it is also a bit of what IGA really wants to do. IGA didn't created the Castlevania franchise, he just directed it for years. Now that he is creating a franchise from the stratch, let the man's creativity be his own guide now.
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Post by purifyweirdshard on Aug 15, 2017 8:01:18 GMT -6
Yes, that's the very important case for making all new/original ideas. It's not about getting in trouble/sued, spiting or not spiting Konami and whatever else - the game should and needs to stand out as much on its own as it can. I think it may already be bothering him enough as it is that he has to reuse so many conventions of the past, but he knows that's what his fans want. It's an effort to make a game that both pleases the fans, but commands the respect of folks who would otherwise write it off as nostalgic pandering.
I love nostalgic pandering personally, lol, and no one is in a better position to get us SotN 2.0, but at the same time, professionally in regards to dignity in moving forward, I think it's too selfish of me to want more of what he's already done. In order for more of this to keep coming and get its own respect, new things have to be made.
And depending on how well it goes, that may all the more cement return of IGA-style conventions in Castlevania itself, whether by him or not, because he kept being able to keep ideas in this spirit relevant, proving the strength of them without the 1:1 image or paint of Castlevania to sell it.
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Post by Enkeria on Aug 15, 2017 8:17:43 GMT -6
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Post by allooutrick on Aug 15, 2017 15:16:51 GMT -6
About the whole "Why IGA don't use Dracula / Death / Skeletons" discussion. I don't like to be the one to break people's hopes, although i believe we have a chance of IGA using something like that (Bloodless is a vampire) i firmly believe, and hope, he doesn't use it. The thing some people must understand is that spiritual sucessor and carbon copy are two different things. A spiritual sucessor is a game that borrows the same feel, gameplay and overall structure from a past game, without copying it to the bone. It's not about Konami trying to sue IGA for plagiarism (although that is also not impossible) is about creating a new IP that is not just a carbon copy of what you worked before. Dracula, Death and such are public domain enemies, that's right. But the game is already looking dangerously close to a Castlevania. Adding all that would make it so similar that IGA could be accused of lack of creativity. You guys don't think the man can do something different then that? That he can't create a villian as cool as Dracula for himself? Or a sidekick as menacing as Death? I believe it is also a bit of what IGA really wants to do. IGA didn't created the Castlevania franchise, he just directed it for years. Now that he is creating a franchise from the stratch, let the man's creativity be his own guide now. That's, perhaps, the most logical justification I've seen for this and I completely agree. |
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